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Author: Subject: palmball or foshball?
PitchingProspect
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posted on 6-14-2004 at 06:30 PM Reply With Quote
What is this pitch???

A guy showed me a pitch the other day since lately I have been struggling with throwing offspeed to lefties. I asked him what it was and he didnt know the name. Nobody else has been able answer so I came to the brainiacs here.

The Ball is held with the sweetspot vertically and tilted to the left. Your index finger is on the left seam, rinbg finger on the right seam and middle finger on the top of the right seam. Sorry I cant find a pic to explain better. Its thrown with a fastball type snap and it has a changeup/sinker result.

Anyone that has an idea what this is, please post it here.
Thanks all,
Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
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"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
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sertman
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posted on 6-14-2004 at 08:37 PM Reply With Quote
sounds to me like a palmball

i think it is from your description, but i don't know
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thesalminator
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 04:55 AM Reply With Quote
it sounds like a ??? change up i forgot the name but eric gagne throws that one. i think they call it the meat ball






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knucklemaster333
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 03:54 PM Reply With Quote
since you use your ring finger i assume its a type of change up if its the one gagne throws its called a F.O.S.H. because it made batters swinging at it look like they are Full Of $%&^

[Edited on 6-15-2004 by knucklemaster333]

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posted on 6-15-2004 at 04:00 PM Reply With Quote
LOL,
Never heard of the FOSH and I am a Dodgers fan!

Anyway, it has more break than a change...almost like a splitter. Its much faster thana change also. Any chance its a cutter variant?
Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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knucklemaster333
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 04:11 PM Reply With Quote
hmm well the one gagne throws is kind of a mix between a splitter and a change up (i think) i forget were i heard that before though i haven't seen much of gagne other than the time he played the pirates in that 14 inning game (which we lost)
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 04:16 PM Reply With Quote
Are you in PA? If so, I am pretty close.
Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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knucklemaster333
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 04:17 PM Reply With Quote
yeah i live in pittsburgh i am a pirates fan
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rmoretti23
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posted on 6-15-2004 at 06:38 PM Reply With Quote
Changeup...sinker.....splitter....

Why don't we name it? How about a "chplinker"? or a "chansplitinker"?





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posted on 6-15-2004 at 07:14 PM Reply With Quote
My vote would be the "Splinkup"
Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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Hardy
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posted on 6-16-2004 at 08:30 PM Reply With Quote
I like the "foshball" haha
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posted on 6-19-2004 at 06:16 AM Reply With Quote
eric gagne throws a circle-change up if im not mistaken. that grip doesnt sound like one though.
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posted on 6-19-2004 at 01:58 PM Reply With Quote
Yes he does throw a circle change, but this isnt a changeup as far as I have seen.
Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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SkippySNK
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posted on 6-21-2004 at 06:28 AM Reply With Quote
Gagnes CURVE

Wow Friday I was watching the Dodgers Vs. Yankees, and Eric Gagne threw the one of the most filthy curves I have ever seen, if not the filthiest. He set up a 67 mph curve with a 98 mph fastball. And he has a weird grip too. Right before he throws it, he'll take his index finger off the ball, so it looks as if he's pointing to the sky when his arm is back. And as for his change, it is a circle-change, he has his middle and ring finger farther apart than normal, but he still makes the circle with his index and thumb.
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rmoretti23
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posted on 6-21-2004 at 12:48 PM Reply With Quote
Thats no changeup

I was watching the Yankee game yesterday against LA and Eric Gagne's changeup hit 90. That's not a changeup. Even Joe Morgan said it's really a splitter. He just calls it a changeup. Then again, when your fastball goes 98, I guess a 90 mph splitter can be used as a changeup.





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SkippySNK
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posted on 6-21-2004 at 09:46 PM Reply With Quote
It's like a hybrid change of sorts. He holds it a little different from a normal circle change grip, and it does act like a splitter, but sometimes he can get it to go about 82-85. Although in the World Series last year Josh Beckett threw a change up that was in the high 80's. I think the flamethrowers changes go fast because they try not to tip the batter off, and Gagnes drops because his circle chnge grip is different. Its more like a hybrid change-split, and its not a freaking foshball. I got Jeff Suppans autograph at an Angels game, a foshballer, and asked his what it does. He gave me the answer of a "fast change-up/ slow forkball."
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thesalminator
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posted on 6-22-2004 at 04:33 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by PitchingProspect
LOL,
Never heard of the FOSH and I am a Dodgers fan!

Anyway, it has more break than a change...almost like a splitter. Its much faster thana change also. Any chance its a cutter variant?
Tom


Its not a Fosh no such thing and Gagne does not throw that.

it sounds like a Line Changeup if all of your fingers eg... Thumb,index,milddle and ring grap a seam its a line changeup.

as for gagne he grabs it like a 2seam fastball but gets his middle on the left seam and his ring on the right. with the index over the thumb and the thumb leans on the side of the ball. thats what gives it the screwball action.






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rmoretti23
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posted on 6-22-2004 at 11:31 AM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by thesalminator he grabs it like a 2seam fastball but gets his middle on the left seam and his ring on the right. with the index over the thumb and the thumb leans on the side of the ball. thats what gives it the screwball action.


See? Screwball ACTION. Now watch Taylor tell me it's a screwball, the word gets into the wrong hands, and some poor Dodgers fan ends up crying because he thinks his superstar closer is a ticking time bomb.





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knuckleballer4life
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posted on 6-22-2004 at 03:05 PM Reply With Quote
grrr...

It's not screwball action! its tailing in! geeeeeeezzzzzzz





TheKnuckler

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thesalminator
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posted on 6-22-2004 at 10:40 PM Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SkippySNK
Wow Friday I was watching the Dodgers Vs. Yankees, and Eric Gagne threw the one of the most filthy curves I have ever seen, if not the filthiest. He set up a 67 mph curve with a 98 mph fastball. And he has a weird grip too. Right before he throws it, he'll take his index finger off the ball, so it looks as if he's pointing to the sky when his arm is back. And as for his change, it is a circle-change, he has his middle and ring finger farther apart than normal, but he still makes the circle with his index and thumb.


I was there. We gave a huge pop for Gagne when he was warming up, and this was during a comercial they showed his grips. what i saw was a Fastball, Curve, and a change up. but his changeup looks diffrent it does look like a circle change but he gets it from a two seam grip with the middle and ring grabing a seam. thats why it has a lot of sink on it.






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posted on 6-24-2004 at 12:53 AM Reply With Quote
FOSH

Al Nipper, formerly of the Red Sox and now Sarasota pitching coach, invented the FOSH, which is so close to a splitter it isn't funny. He just placed his fingers barely outside the seams and fired. It's not far removed from a two-seamer, just with a little more sink, and not quite to the low spin of a splitter or forkball. As a variation you could apply a fair amount of pressure to the bottonm of the ball, which may allow you to let it slip out of those top two fingers and have some forward spin, not a lot different from the Thing. Maybe.

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knuckleballer4life
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posted on 6-24-2004 at 01:12 AM Reply With Quote
Thing

The
Hitter
is
never
ganna

hit it





TheKnuckler

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posted on 6-24-2004 at 01:20 AM Reply With Quote
ANSWER...

I found out from a few guys in the Dodgers organization what this mystery pitch that Gagne Throws is...

Its a TAILING CHANGEUP. Has the movement of a tailing fastball, but is 82-85 MPH. Looking to work on it and add it to me bag o' tricks.

Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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thesalminator
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posted on 6-24-2004 at 04:36 AM Reply With Quote
its more of a dirty splitter. every time i go to dodger games they show the same thing. i havent had a chance to talk to him this year. these are the dodger pitchers i already shook hands with.

Kaz Ishi
Darren Drieifort
Guillermo Mota
Tom Martin
Weaver
Jose Lima
Paul Shuey

everytime Gagne comes out alot of kids rush at him. but he does sign a couple of autographs. i think its hilarious cause last year he only lived a couple of blocks from My house. and whenever i passed by his neighborhood i would see him just chilling on his porch, he is so lazy. but i guess he bought a new house i havent seen him in a while. he also had a Blue Hummer.






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posted on 6-24-2004 at 12:48 PM Reply With Quote
???

I dont get it...
I am not guessing anymore...I am TELLING YOU what it is. Its NOT "more a dirty splitter"-- its a TAILING CHANGEUP. Those words came direct from people in the Dodgers organization that have caught for Gagne. If the Goon calls it a tailing changeup, then so will I.

As far as I have seen, splitters dont break away from/toward batters. This pitch does.

Tom





"Hitting the knuckleball is like eatin' Jello with chopsticks."
-Willie Stargell

"Trying to sneak a fastball past Hank Aaron is like trying to sneak a sunrise past a rooster."
-Curt Simmons, All Star Pitcher

"No one can throw a fastball past me. God could come down from Heaven and He couldn't throw it past me."
-Ted Williams

ladodgersfan2004@yahoo.com

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